Got my Ebay Graf Galaxy Boots !!! / Blade mounting questions

[SkatingOnClouds]

A few weeks ago I posted about needing wide fitting supportive boots, being a middle aged fat person with bunions. And although I started out asking about Gams, I ended up buying Graf Galaxys, because they were on sale on Ebay for US $275.

Well, they finally arrived today, and I am rapt! They fit - just - they will need some stretching to fit those bunions. They are so snug, and very light, yet already I can feel the improvement in ankle support. And they look to be in perfect condition.

Can't wait to fit my old phantom blades to them so I can try them out. Which brings me to a whole new line of questioning.

( Those who are about to recommend I go to the pro shop at my rink, stop now: it isn't an option where I live)

I've read that I should be coating my new boot soles and heels with sno-seal or similar, preferably before I mount the blades. I ordered sno-seal, but the shop was out. What is the alternative - Australian skaters might be able to help with local alternatives here? Is this coating essential for someone who skates only on weekends, when skates have all week to dry out?

Mounting the blades. Which holes need counter-sunk screws, which need the regular screws? Am I correct in thinking I don't put screws in all the holes?
Is mounting going to be as easy as down the middle - although I like the heel plate slightly to the inside of centre as, being fat, it's hard to get my balance over the blade and I would pronate slightly inwards.

Anything else I need to know, or any advice about mounting my own blades?

And then there's heat moulding. My husband has access to a convection oven, so I hope to take them to his work to do it. Should I mould before mounting the blades, or after?

Oh boy, have I got a lot to figure out before Saturday morning (it's Thursday night here) !!!

Any advice on these things would be welcomed

Karen

[stardust skies]

I HIGHLY reccomend you *send* them out to a pro shop in the nearest big city that has a good reputation. I've sent out my skates to be rebuilt before, heck I've even sent them out just to be sharpened (I only trust one guy...) when I am out of town. You can fed-ex them overnight, or 3-day for a more cost-effecive deal. Overnight costs about 50 bucks overall. It's WORTH it.

I'm kinda concerned that you got one of the lightest boots on the market if you say you are a little overweight though (and fully grown, at that..) Hopefully you won't be jumping too much in them. I wouldn't expect them to last you more than 6 months if you are skating everyday and doing single jumps. Just a heads up.

PS: even if you insist on doing everything yourself, please at least get them mounted professionally. It will already hinder you big time that they cannot align the blade to your body, and you never never really have the blade where it need to be, which can be a huge problem, but at least if you send them out, you're sure they'll have been set up completely straight and exactly where they need to be. A millimiter off the center DOES make a difference.

[Mrs Redboots]

My coach is good at mounting/adjusting blades; it could well be that yours knows how, too. Worth asking.... and if they don't know, they may well know who "does" them at your rink, so again, well worth asking!

If you do them yourself, only put 2 screws each end, and don't permanently mount them until you're sure they don't need adjusting further. You use the slidy holes in the toe end, so they can be adjusted if necessary.

As for the heat moulding, wear them for a bit first, as you may find they don't need it (mine didn't). What I did for the toe-box was to use a 10 ml bottle of essential oil - it was exactly the right size to punch it out a bit! And I don't lace the top 3 holes (the ones nearest my toes) on that foot, AND I use a pad - all of which means my bunion doesn't hurt at all now.

[Skate@Delaware]

I second what Stardust says. If your blades are off, everything is affected. My right blade wasn't mounted correctly (by my in-house "pro-shop") and it affected my landings, 3-turns, crossovers, etc. It was off 1/8"-2/8"!

The shop you send them to can also sno-seal.

As far as heat-molding, you may not even need it! Or if you find you have a certain area that still bugs you after skating on them after a bit, take a hair dryer and heat up that part of the skate to heat it up (I've heard of people doing this). There are also heat-molding instructions on the Rainbo Sports website http://www.rainbosports.com/

[Joeyw28]

About coating, yes you must because boots will last longer. You may be able to get some varnish from the hardware store. But be carefull, some varnish will trap water inside the boot. so read the instructions on the label carefully.

Mounting instructions can be found here:
http://www.mkblades.com/care/instructions.html

here's a picture i draw of the slotted holes at the back of the blade.
http://rapidshare.de/files/7433224/slotted.jpg.html
these holes need flat faced screws. The rest of the holes need counter-sunk.

here's a picture i draw about mounting
http://rapidshare.de/files/7433170/mount.jpg.html
the picture shows the back of a right boot.
pic 1 = mount toe and heel of blade to the center of the line. i think this is the standard mounting.

pic 2 = mount heel of blade to the center of line, toe of blade slightly to the inside edge(half the blade width). This is what the MK instructions said.

pic 3 = mount heel and toe of blade to the inside edge of the boot. this is what i do. I have severe pronation and i use custom orthotics.

if anyone else has a different opinion about mounting, please share.

make sure you use stainless steel screws. they are slightly expensive than normal screws, but they will not rust easily.

here's a pdf file about blade allignment for pronated feet.
http://www.aapsm.org/humble-skatinga.pdf

if you pronate, you might think of getting orthotics or special insoles to correct your pronation. You may try over-the-counter insoles. make sure they are 3/4 length and not full length. most full length will not fit inside the boot. if they don't work, you can see a podiatrist to make an orthotics for you.

this link is about pronation.
http://www.harlick.com/order/faq.php
look under the title "Why do I fall to an inside edge all the time?"

this link is an example of one of the 3/4 length insoles.
http://www.feetrelief.com/feetrelief/Powerstep_34.htm


Heat molding before you mount. that way you can save the trouble of carrying extra weight.

please correct me if i'm wrong

[Isk8NYC]

Where did you come from, Joey? You're a fountain of knowledge and links!
We should add your note to the equipment sticky.
Thanks!

As for waterproofing, SnoSeal is a beeswax product that you melt into the leather to make it water resistant. If you get a similar product from Eastern Mountain Sports, LandsEnd or other outdoor store, it'll probably work just as well.

I used to varnish my skates and it really wasn't as good as sealing them. I had water rot problems, stripped screws, flaking varnish. Stick with the waxes.

As for the mounting, ask around at your rink for a candidate. It's really not a one-person job. Even if you understood the placement, you can't see how the blades are positioned when they're on your own feet.

Check out Joey's links for the placement notes - between certain toes, under the heel. Do a search and include the archives -- there are multiple threads about mounting blades. A bit of advice: the blade DOES NOT line up with the toe seam of the boot and it may/may not go down the middle of the sole. Oh, and DON'T reuse the holes from the old blade. Get some leather glue and laces at a craft store and fill those holes tightly. Then, start from scratch with the new mounting. I had a fitter stupidly reuse the holes and he actually warped the $500 blade! It took six adjustments to give me the same edges in front and back.

Don't put in every screw. Start with the slotted ones, then add 1-2 of the sunken screws once you're sure the mounting's good. Then, if any get stripped, you have additional holes that you can fill to make sure the blade doesn't come off in the middle of a competition warmup, leaving you stranded on the ice in front of the judges, forcing you to have a friend help you get off the ice on one foot. :oops: (He was so kind, too - he put in a new screw while I was still wearing my boots! I have good friends, don't I?)

Are you planning any vacations that might be near a good fitter?

[blue111moon]

Re: Sno Seal -- I had a hard time getting it in my area so I took a friend's advice and used the wax they use to polish hardwood floors and non-polyurithaned bowling alleys. I bought a tub of it at a hardward store maybe ten years ago, use it same way you use Sno Seal, and that tub is still only about half empty. The only caveat is that you must use it in a well-ventillated area because it smells strong when you warm it up with the hairdrier. But it works great and puts a nice shine on the leather soles, too.

I'm not picky about my blade mounting and I would never, ever try to do it myself. I've too many people ruin their boots that way to want to risk it myself.

[SkatingOnClouds]

Thanks everyone, especially Joey - fount of knowledge.
I get the picture, that this isn't as straight forward as one might think.

Have to admit I mounted my blades myself this time - and have had balance problems the whole time. That could be simply because my centre of balance is different to when I skated 20 years ago - my body remembers how it used to be. Or because my current boots are at least one size too big, and my old blades therefore too short.

I doubt my rink's ability to mount the blades correctly. I am not confident they know enough to do anything other than a one-size fits-all sort of rental skate mount (years ago the guy simply couldn't believe that where he put them wasn't right for me. He humoured me, and we finally got them right).
I may be doing them an injustice, things might have changed, and I guess I should talk to them about it.

Because of my bunions the boots will need some stretching before they are comfortable. I will try the heat molding first, then work on any stretching required, then seal them. After that, mounting.

I have decided not to rush the process in an attempt to get them ready for tomorrow, but to take my time to get the fit and mount correct. I only skate on weekends, and am going away next weekend, so if I don't rush to get them done for tomorrow, that gives me two weeks to do this right.

Karen

[Skate@Delaware]

A bit of advice: the blade DOES NOT line up with the toe seam of the boot and it may/may not go down the middle of the sole.
This is what messed up my blade-the "pro-shop" mounted my blade based on the seam and the seam was skewed....when I pointed out the problem I was told that it was mounted correctly, because "here is the seam and see how the blade matches it?"....when I showed the soles and how off they were from right and left he said I must have shifted the blade when I skated....(yes, after 2 permanent screws were put in on the ball of the foot) :frus:

So, it really can't be lined up that way.

[aussieskater]

Hi Karen - I'm very glad you got your boots OK. Happy skating!

I know there's no pro shop near your rink (or even in the same state - the nearest one is over the water...), so would second Mrs Redboots in suggesting you talk to a coach at the rink, even if you don't have a coach yourself yet. If you offer to pay for the coach's time spent blade-mounting, it should not create any expectation on the part of the coach that you will use that coach when you're ready to get coaching.

While I agree with Stardust about sending your boots away to be rebuilt or even blades sharpened (heck, if my only choice re sharpening was "the rink" or "the mail", then where our rink is concerned, it's "the mail" every time!!), I can't see the point in sending them away to be mounted when you're not "away" with them to at least stand in them and let the mounter/fitter see whether you're standing inside or outside or square on top of the blade?

My blades were mounted similar to Joey's - in fact, the left one has the toe end of the sole plate slightly visible from the up-side of the boot on the inside, which is how far it is to the inside it had to go (yes Joey, pronation and custom orthotics, same as you). It took a few goes to get it right. (Thank goodness for temporary screws.) I can't see how it could have been done without me there.

Sno-Seal is very hard for us to get, but I find Dubbin (available from Woolies or a shoe repairer or even a farrier - it's actually for saddles) works brilliantly. It smells a bit though when you first apply it, so do it outside.

[Oz_sk8ing_Mum]

Hi Guys,

You can get Sno-Seal in Oz. They sell it at Boots Camping stores and it's $9.00.
They have it at our local Boot's in Penrith so if you can't get it I can always duck down and post it out to you, I don't mind.

Regards
Oz_Sk8ting_mum :)