dance test difficulty: US vs. Canada

[phoenix]

I've been wondering about this, because I've heard of LOTS of very young skaters who've passed all their dances in Canada, & it seems I've read about an awful lot of people who've been working on dance for a year or two, & they're already very high up, or through with, their tests. In the US, that's unheard of for the most part. It takes years & years to get through your golds, if you ever do.

We basically have the same compulsories. So--are the testing standards different in Canada & the US? In Canada do you have to solo the tests as well as partner them? is the music tempo the same (I'm pretty sure it would be, since that's a competition thing)? How many patterns of the dance do you skate?

For example, here in the States (or maybe I should say in my area of the country) at your average test sesson, the girls taking pre-golds & up I'd say average at least 15 years old. VERY rare to see someone younger getting to that level. And by the time you hit silver or pre-gold, you're usually only testing one, *maybe* two dances at a shot.

I'm wondering why the Canadians seem to fly through the dance test structure, where in the States we most definitely don't!

[luna_skater]

In Canada we no longer have mandatory solos. There are dances at each level that the skater has the option to solo, and the evaluator is allowed to request a solo if he or she feels its necessary (exception is Prelim and Diamond).

I'm not sure how many required patterns there are...it might be minimum 1 and maximum 2.

I personally went through my dances at lightning speed because I already knew how to skate. I've been skating for 20 years and competing in synchro for 14. I had taken CanSkate and CanFigure, but never tested anything. Whatever we needed to learn for our synchro program, the coach just taught us. I started dance at the age of 22. I did all of my dances in just over a year, and I know a few other people who were in similar situations as me.

However, there's no way I would have passed that fast if I'd had to solo. Skating holding on to someone is natural for me because of my synchro experience. I think if we'd had mandatory solos when I began, I would have had to test all my skills first to get used to skating alone.

I also had an excellent coach for my dances. I've seen some pretty crappy stuff put up to test by others...

[twokidsskatemom]

It also seems like in Canada even young skaters learn ice dance, and in the USA its older kids who ice dance.My young skaters coach said she will test dance before FS.

[luna_skater]

Yes, it's like that at my club...all the freeskaters test dance as well.

There is also a lot of inconsistent judging out there. I've seen plenty of dances pass that I don't think should have. And some that I thought would pass for sure and didn't. A friend of mine in another province has gotten mostly excellents on all her tests. My last test day (skills), when the evaluator handed me my test sheet she said that she NEVER gives excellents, so I should consider my "goods" to be extremely good.

[phoenix]

How are the tests scored? Here, it's based on the 6.0 system, & with each test, there's a minimum score you must receive. With each level, the minimum passing score goes up.

Most dance tests require 3 patterns, some of the waltzes only two, & a few you do 4 (kilian, for example). Once you start to solo (at silver), you do the required # of patterns w/ your partner, then go right back out & solo 2 patterns.

Passing all your tests in a year, even for someone who is already a strong skater, is almost impossible here. Remember all the fuss that was made over Stephanie Steigler, who passed all her tests in under a year? And she had been an elite pairs skater before--and it was still astonishing that she pulled it off.

[slusher]

There's two different test streams, competitive and starskate. Canadian starskate dance tests are judged by one judge. It's only when you get to diamonds (international) that it has to be 3 panel and then they're very hard to pass or even find a panel. Competitive dance tests are also 3 panel and the level of skating required is higher. The skaters you hear about who have flown through their dances would definitely be Starskate or test skaters.

A single judge who's been judging for six hours and it's 11pm at night, yeah, stuff gets passed that shouldn't in the proper light of day.

[luna_skater]

For the Canadian tests, you get NI (Needs Improvement), S (Satisfactory), G (Good) or E (Excellent) on each of 6 components (timing, style/form, expression, unison, etc.). You need a certain number of S's to pass. I think by the time you hit Jr. Silver, you need min. all S's to pass.

Canadian tests used to be scored under 6.0. I'm not sure how long ago the change was made.

Slusher, are you sure about the 3-panel for Diamonds? I'm almost positive I've seen a diamond test done with just one evaluator.

[phoenix]

Ah, forgot--we can have 1 judge for preliminary & pre-bronze, & from then on you have to have 3. 2 out of the 3 judges have to pass you.

Very interesting about the 2 test streams--that definitely helps explain it!!

[luna_skater]

Very interesting about the 2 test streams--that definitely helps explain it!!

I'm a little unclean on that; perhaps Slusher could explain. I was under the impression that everyone (rec or competitive skaters) tested the same compulsory dances under the same guidelines. But then the competitive dancers must also test a competitive freeskate at the level at which they are competing. Slusher, can you clarify what you mean?

[iskatealot]

[QUOTE=luna_skater] I was under the impression that everyone (rec or competitive skaters) tested the same compulsory dances under the same guidelines. But then the competitive dancers must also test a competitive freeskate at the level at which they are competing. SluQUOTE]

The StarSkaters and Competitive skaters do all test the same dances. Competitive skaters and starskaters all must test freeskate tests in order to compete at a certain level, however the star skate tests are different from the competitive tests.

[Layback]

when i started figure skating, Canada had just started to introduce the evaluation system for tests. that was in 1990. a number of my dances were tested under the 6.0 system with a panel of 3 judges. as i progressed through the dances i had parts of some levels tested under both systems because evaluation was phased in later for the intermediate and then gold level tests.
my personal view is that since the evaluation system was introduced and the panel was pared down to one person, a greater number of poorly skated tests, particularly dance, were passed. as an evaluator now i see all sorts of tests and i feel sometimes the requirements are too lax compared to when i tested, and heaven knows compared to those used when skaters older than me were testing. i recall that in my club only 2 girls had completed the gold dance test in 1990, yet by 1995 more than half of the skaters had passed at least sr. silver if not their golds. this overlaps exactly with the introduction of the evaluation system.
just as a coda, when i evaluate i do not give out G or E very often--every test day i give out some G's but I cant remember the last E awarded. i am probably regarded as the 'evil' judge but i want to make sure that skaters are prepared for the next level, and give them as much constructive feedback as possible so that i can award those G's or maybe even E's the next time around.

[slusher]

oops, yeah, in 2002 Diamond dances could be evaluated by one judge. My club only lets diamond dances test on competitive test days so it looks like there's still 3 judges there, but probably only one is doing the evaluation. My error. It used to be next to impossible to get a diamond test in somewhere, when I asked around today, I found more than a few girls doing diamonds. I guess the single evaluator rule has really opened up.

Dancers have to test a stroking exercise and a freedance to pass the competitive dance test (pre-novice, novice, jr, sr). Compulsory dances are done in competition and marked to a much higher standard than the same dance in a starskate test. I watch a competitive pair do the Kilian, there is absolutely no comparison to a test skater, even one who got excellents.

[luna_skater]

The StarSkaters and Competitive skaters do all test the same dances. Competitive skaters and starskaters all must test freeskate tests in order to compete at a certain level, however the star skate tests are different from the competitive tests.

Thanks for the clarification. I was getting confused because I thought the original poster was just asking about compulsory tests, not free dance.

[phoenix]

I was under the impression, from Slusher's posts, that w/ the 2 different test streams, although you skate the same compulsories, the competitive test has a higher passing standard & requires more judges to conduct the test. Is that correct?

[luna_skater]

I was under the impression, from Slusher's posts, that w/ the 2 different test streams, although you skate the same compulsories, the competitive test has a higher passing standard & requires more judges to conduct the test. Is that correct?

This is what I was trying to figure out as well. I don't believe so, but if someone could clear this up once and for all, it would be greatly appreciated!

For instance, I have passed all of my gold dances. I don't think that if I were to become a competitive dancer, I would have to re-take all my dances. I think that I would just have to pass the free dance tests with my partner.

[Layback]

This is what I was trying to figure out as well. I don't believe so, but if someone could clear this up once and for all, it would be greatly appreciated!

For instance, I have passed all of my gold dances. I don't think that if I were to become a competitive dancer, I would have to re-take all my dances. I think that I would just have to pass the free dance tests with my partner.
yes i think youre right luna_skater.
and with respect to the diamonds, im very certain they are single panelled now as well. not that there are a lot of diamond dance evaluators around!

[the old gurl]

yes i think youre right luna_skater.
and with respect to the diamonds, im very certain they are single panelled now as well. not that there are a lot of diamond dance evaluators around!Daughter passed her golds shortly after her 12th birthday and finished her diamonds a couple months after her 16th birthday. When the Samba and ChaChaCongelado were added to the test stream, she went back and did those. Standards *have* been lowered somewhat since she started testing in 1992. I see things pass now that never would have passed back then. Heck, *I've* passed dances I'm sure wouldn't have passed back then.

The rationale behind going from a 6.0 to evaluated tests for the test stream was to encourage test skaters more, since most of our skaters will never been competitive skaters. Too many were dropping out because the standards were so tough. Getting the Diamond test is still no mean feat -- and not everyone finishes the Golds either, but they ARE attainable. She did diamonds both with triple panels and single panels and much preferred the single panels, even with the 'tough' judges.

It also does appear that Canadian skaters start testing dances earlier than their American counterparts for the most part. Most skaters here have passed at least the Prelim dances, and often the Junior and Senior bronze before their first freeskate test -- certainly not uncommon.