Public skating Private lessons

[vintagefreak]

Hello,

This is a question about public sessions and the freestyle private lessons that take place at our rink. How would you feel about this and how would you approach management if you were in my place.

My daughter has limited time to practice so she attends the public sessions on the weekends to mainly work on crossovers, power etc. and in general to have fun and I go with her for the same reasons. These sessions are crowded, the lights are dimmed and the disco ball on. Nobody in their right mind should go to these weekend sessions with freestyle in mind, yet many of the pros at our rink seem to think its an excellent time to give private lessons and some even have their portable stereos with them and actually work on programs with students! This isn't limited to the center of the rink - they conduct lessons anywhere they please on the ice and go against traffic, etc. Its easier to deal with the aggressive hockey skaters than the pros and their tots in these situations because they are so unpredictable and visability is poor. Today I'm to the boiling point because one of the coaches actually did a loud, irritated sounding "excuse me" shout-out to my daughter as she was spinning in the center. She had to stop her spin and get out of the way fast. The student was coming through with her program!

This isn't a freestyle session! Why should public skaters have to kiss the butts of the pros and their students? Why do you think the coaches seem so irritated by everyone who is skating for fun or exercise? There are gererally about 5 coaches who conduct multiple lessons during the public sessions. Granted, not every kid has access to f/s sessions and our rink is especially limited in the way of freestyle but....this is pushing it.

What would you do? My daughter and I both take private lessons (at the f/s sessions) and we don't want to tick off many of the other pros or alienate ourselves in the club by complaining (thank goodness our sensible coach doesn't do this) but its also annoying to the point where my daugther is in tears and thinks shes always in the way and we're all getting the impression nobody cares about safety. I really don't know what to do.

Thanks for letting me vent and I'd love comments. Thanks!

[dbny]

My daughter had many, many lessons on public sessions, but they were never evening sessions with poor lighting, and she never even practiced a program on public ice. MIF were limited on public sessions depending on the crowd, and all jumps and spins had to be done in the center execpt at the few really empty sessions. No coach I know would attempt to have a student skate a program on a crowded public session. Do you think the arena management would be receptive to complaints? If so, you should phrase the complaint in terms of safety, as that is a very legitimate concern in a well run arena.

[twokidsskatemom]

My skaters have had lesson on ps when it was empty, or just a few skaters during the day when most people are at work/school.
Im sorry but unless a rink is real empty I dont think a skater has any more rights than Mr skater off the street.That is why rinks offer fs and that is why we pay more money, to be able to teach, do program run thoughs ect.
I would say something, to me it is a safety issue.

[Aussie Willy]

Well my thing about public sessions is they are for the general public and the general public has the right of way. But in the figure sessions it is the person with the program on who has the right of way.

We have lots of skaters have lessons in public sessions. Have done so myself for years. However I have never taken the attitude that I have the right of way. And most of the coaches, even though they might be using a tape player are aware of this unwritten rule and would never abuse another person in the session because they have gotten in a skaters way. In fact it usually ends up with everyone having a good laugh because most people at my rink get on really well with each other.

Having said that, when I see someone having a lesson in a public session I keep out of their way and I do expect the same courtesy from others. It is very annoying when it is clear you are having a lesson (usually working on spins) and someone keeps skating in the same patch of ice that you are trying to work in. There are some people who just seem to gravitate towards the same area you want to work in which can be really frustrating and it usually is always the same person.

[jestemkkool]

I used to take private lessons on public session along with one other skater. I did this with my friend who coached me, and with my real private(former) instructor. I also was forced to choreograph my routine on public ice. But instead of making the public skate around me. I just skated around them. I didn't use my music unless I was with my friend, because those public session were empty- except for the other 10 figure skaters on the ice.
For the most part, the public session I went to ver the summer was filled with regulars so everyone knew where the others were going to be(public, hockey, and figure skaters). So we would stick to our own areas and if we needed more space, we would wait until there was an opening. Everyone seemed respectful of the others.

You should complain to the rink managment if the instructors are dominating public ice. It isn't right, if they want use of that ice for lessons, they need to share it with the public skaters, and they should yeild to the other skaters because, unlike the public, they do have use of special freestyle sessions.

[NoVa Sk8r]

I must say ... that is very irritating. And it happens all over, I'm sure.
Once on a weekend public in my home rink, a coach had her student do her program--several times!
The student was attempting doubles in a crowded public session. I was kind of humored by the whole thing since the student was visibly upset that the hoi poloi were not getting out of her way.

I told the coach (whom I cannot stand) that doing a program in a public session was not only unsafe and stupid, but that it was unfair to her student. What merit could her student possibly get by having to abort nearly half her elements and put herself in harm's way? Plus, the coach would shut off the music from the public sound system and follow her student around with the tape deck. I made it a point to get in her student's way and when questioned, I would tell the coach, "Oh, was this a freestlye session?" :halo:

But, ugh, makes me sick to think about that situation. I'm glad that person is no longer coaching.

[fadedstardust]

Well, it's really up to management- someday, they'll have a serious accident and they'll realize that they have to forbid those coaches from doing freestle on busy weekend ice. In the meantime, the only thing I can tell you for SURE, is that no matter where you are or what you are doing, if you are spinning, then you have right of way over someone setting up a jump, especially if you are spinning in the center (the unofficial "home" of spins). If someone is "coming through" they can go around, that's how it goes. So that coach clearly needs to brush up on their skating etiquette.

[Blosmbubbs]

I have heard that if a skater is in a lesson they have the right away if they are doing a program in a lesson. But I don't know about the coach following with a tape player? At my rink if I go to the evening public I always see about 10 coaches giving lessons and it is so bad. I try to avoid them espeically if they are doing a program. I think a good idea would be having a portable barrier around the ice so the center can be for figure skating and the outside can be for those who just skate around. I saw this at our outdoor rink and it looks pretty cool. I had a coach say something to me one time I was setting up for a jump and he was standing where I was about to do my 3 turn. I went to do the jump about 3 times and he still was standing there, so the 3rd time I got kind of mad and he said this isnt a freestyle session. There were about 10 people on the ice. He had no right to tell me that, unless he wants to pay for me to skate freestyle! It wasn't his student that was in the way it was him. Coaches need to stand out of the way or they will get hit!!!! :evil:

[NickiT]

We have regular public sessions on our rink and also disco sessions where the lights are dimmed and the disco ball is on. The coaches teach in the regular sessions, but never in the disco sessions. I cannot see the point in trying to coach during such sessions. It would be complete nonsense and I fully understand why you are upset about it. I think it's worth you having a talk with rink management about it.

Nicki

[trains]

Canadian coaches are no longer insured for any icetime other than club sanctioned sessions.

[Skatewind]

Usually a complaint to the rink management will take care of the problem. They often don't know the coaches are conducting themselves in this manner on the public session unless they are told. & the skate guards don't always tell them if they are friendly with the coaches. Rinks in my area don't allow programs on public sessions, & no coaches are doing the "get out of my way" admonishment to the general skaters during such sessions. It seems to me if the rink is going to allow this, then it should be included in their general skating rules that are usually posted for public sessions so the public skaters are forewarned.

The coaches I see who teach on public sessions yield to the masses & don't act like the example you have given.

[Mrs Redboots]

As far as I know our coaches don't teach during the disco sessions, but they certainly teach on other public sessions. In the day-time, they teach school groups (this is a requirement of their contract), and twice a week in the evenings there are adult learn-to-skate classes, and most of those who teach them have at least one, if not two, private lessons afterwards. This is also the norm at the rink we occasionally skate at on a Monday night, where there is also a 15-minute dance interval, during which at least one teacher continues giving afree skating lesson, to the dancers' irritation! To be fair, she and her pupil do give way to the dancers, but.....

When there are group classes in public sessions, the end of the rink is coned off for this purpose, of course.

[dbny]

Canadian coaches are no longer insured for any icetime other than club sanctioned sessions.

Yikes 8O

That would be the end of my coaching career!

[sue123]

at one of the rinks i go to, the only lessons they have on public ice are the basic skating lessons. They cone off an end of the rink for the beginners to skate in, and that's where the beginner lessons are taught. The center stays open (usually) for figure skaters, and the rest is for the public skaters. Although the guards aren't too strict about enforcing the center figure skate rule, they are pretty strict when it comes to the beginner section. But no coach should be giving a lesson using hte entire public ice and with dimmed light. It's dangerous to the skater and the other people.

[slusher]

Yikes 8O

That would be the end of my coaching career!

Not so in Canada, because of the strong club system. It's just different north of the border. Clubs get a lot of ice time compared to public recreational skates. Using one of the clubs I belong to, which is based out of that city's single arena, the figure skating club has 11.5 hours of ice a week available and yes, I skate on most of that as well as skate in two other clubs. The single "public" skate is two hours on a Sunday afternoon with 150 people on it going around in circles, and you can't figure skate let alone even skate backwards. So, anyone who figure skates joins a club and uses club ice, which is monitored, well lit, and has someone in control of the music player.

If I have time in the day to go figure skating, dead ice is something like $5 per hour, just me and the coach. That is approved by the skating club, so we're all insured.

Umm, coaches do not pay fees to clubs for the privilege of coaching. Skaters pay the club for ice, coaches show up and make their fees off the students. Coaches have to be approved by the clubs, so the only risky part of being a coach, is keeping in good graces with your club (s).

[dbny]

If I have time in the day to go figure skating, dead ice is something like $5 per hour, just me and the coach.
8O 8O 8O
I do not know of any official use of dead ice at any rink I've ever skated at. I do luck into a bit of free dead ice at a rink I prefer not to name or even hint at, as it is a personal courtesy.


Umm, coaches do not pay fees to clubs for the privilege of coaching. Skaters pay the club for ice, coaches show up and make their fees off the students. Coaches have to be approved by the clubs, so the only risky part of being a coach, is keeping in good graces with your club (s).

It's the same here, but I'm on the outs with the only local club, and have been for years (long story, it's their loss). I used to belong to SCNY but the branch I was a member of folded and the freestyle ice is now offered by the rink, which currently has no club and is not likely to get one anytime in the near future.

[Mrs Redboots]

Umm, coaches do not pay fees to clubs for the privilege of coaching. Skaters pay the club for ice, coaches show up and make their fees off the students. Coaches have to be approved by the clubs, so the only risky part of being a coach, is keeping in good graces with your club (s).Here, they do pay fees to the rink for the privilege of coaching, plus they are required to teach school and learn-to-skate groups (which they do get paid to do, but not a great deal). They don't pay the clubs, though, but then, our system is different to yours.

[vintagefreak]

Thank you all very much for the helpful replies. I don't know still. Its such a weird atmosphere at our rink, one like I've never encountered elsewhere. Its terrible, to be very honest.

My opinion is that they have too many pros for their own good, for starters. This rink is a mill when it comes to figure skating (especially Learn to skate) and I think most of it stems from management concerned with making a profit more than having happy customers or having their skaters stick with it long term. Some of the pros seem underqualified (which explains why they do the things I ranted about in my original post) and they don't have enough freestyle sessions to accomodate the large and ever growing numbers of figure skaters. They have a very limited number of f/s sessions to begin with. So, it trickles down to the publics. Public sessions are the overflow and lots of kids desperately want to practice or have their lessons so they do it there.

Most f/s sessions are packed (more than 25 and I've counted 40 at one session!) and I hate going to them and my daughter is terrified but wants to practice so she goes to a few each week. Maybe the coaches who teach at the publics are as frustrated as we are about the freestyle sessions and they just don't care anymore. I've complained here about them but now when I think about it, maybe they are desperate to help their kids get some ice time and will do anything, even running thru programs. I'm trying to be compassionate and see things through their eyes.

But, the problems are deeper than just what I've talked about above. The club is a club on paper only. When we joined, we got a phone call saying "welcome to the club" and we got our USFSA membership sent in and that was it. They don't hold meetings that we know of, don't update their bulletin board or website (its like, 2001) and don't have a newsletter. They don't do any fundraising and they hardly ever schedule USFSA test sessions. They have to buy ice at other rinks for that. There is no club ice. They don't have a club show. On and on and on. If you want to complain, you can always see the pro shop staff. They have teenagers sharpening figure blades in there and they double as skate fitters. Oh joy. The bathrooms and locker rooms are filthy, the zam breaks down pretty regularly ( so they use it sparingly), the skate guards are apathetic. If you fall and don't get up, they may or may not skate right past you. I doubt seriously if they'd administer First Aid, if they even know it. I had to help a woman off the ice once, along with a pro. The guards were gone.


I would love to complain and am so close to doing so but I honestly don't think management cares. I think there are profoundly deep problems there and I might have to just bite the bullet and drive twice as far to a better rink but the 90 minute drive might be worth it. Thanks all. At least I know there are people here who care about this.