Ergonomic skates?

[Casey]

Has anybody else heard of these?

http://www.ergoweb.com/news/detail.cfm?id=1037

If skating on a single thin blade across a pond of frozen water seems like an impossibly painful endeavor, the sport may be about to get better. That's because engineers are working on, and currently testing, a new ice skate that may make ice skating a little more comfortable, and easier, too.

The key to the change of the ice skate is in the boot - traditionally a rigid leather boot intended to keep a skater's ankle in an almost fixed position. The new skate, being developed by researchers at the University of Delaware, features a hinged design that allows the ankle some degree of flex which in turn may improve jumps, landings and comfort.

[doubletoe]

Interesting. We'll have to keep an eye out for the new boot from Jackson-Ultima!

[fadedstardust]

Heh, they're just trading one kind of injury for another. Instead of having hip and back injuries, it'll be ankle and knee injuries. I would never wear these boots if you paid me, I actually don't really want my ankles to absorb the landing of a triple jump, no thanks. I've sprained them enough as it is. It's odd that they're going through with this, because the doctors and coaches I've spoken to in passing about this all think it'll just bring on more injuries, not less. Guess we'll see, all I know is I highly doubt many skaters will be willing to change what works well enough, these are skates for a couple of generations down the line, I think.

[TashaKat]

I heard of these boots a while ago and wouldn't touch them with a bargepole either. Apart from fadedstardust's points I also think that putting in a hinge is just increasing the likelyhood of skate failure plus I don't have a very good opinion of Jackson's, IMO they're ok as skates when you're starting out but not after that.

The new design, said Dr. Jim Richards, director of the university’s biomechanics laboratory, allows a skater to land toe-first before the rest of the foot hits the ice, thus reducing the impact of landing. “With the hinged design, you can land with your heel relatively high in the air, increasing the landing time and resulting in a lot less stress on the knees, hips and spine,” Richards said. “The current boot is so rigid that it’s like putting your ankle in a cast. It forces skaters to land flat-footed, which leads to the injuries you see so often -— sometimes to the foot itself but primarily to the joints.”

A blatant error in this! How many of skaters who jump land flat footed? Ok, it may happen a couple of times when you're learning but we're always taught to land so that you land 'toe' first and then roll through the foot. Look at some of the top skaters and see what they're feet are doing in the air. I've never had any problems with pointing my toe in boots (unless I forget because I'm concentrating on other things). The other thing is that it ISN'T like having your ankle in a cast, yes, boots are supportive but even my double duo concrete Harlicks allow movement.

This guy obviously doesn't know much about skating!

For me it's a big http://www.kidstogether.org/images/j0097899.gif

[sk8pics]

I haven't read this particular article, but perhaps the author has made some mistakes in interpreting his own sources for it. I know several skaters who have tried out the boot and they all seemed to like it. And yes, they're doing doubles and triples. I haven't heard of any injuries, but that doesn't mean there haven't been any, though.

Pat

[sue123]

i heard about them a while ago when quads became popular. there was a special i think about some girl who was doing a triple and landed and then dislocated her hip or somethng like that. although personally, i would never use them. it would probably just lead to bad technique and form. definitly not worth it. the author of the article didn't know what he was talking about, just trying to sell a product. i don't know, maybe they'll become popular with the recreational skating crowd who always complain they can't bend their knees, but i can't see them ever gaining any sort of status with the competitive crowd, if they'd even be allowed in competition.

[Casey]

I tend to agree TashaKat and fadedstardust...

Especially about the statement that skaters land flat-footed, which is blatently wrong (and hard to do, it seems).

When I got my first skates which had little in the way of support, I appreciated the ability to move my ankles more. Compared to the rigid leather rental skates, it was "easier" because my balance was still very poor. But stiffer boots were sooooo much better when I changed to them after urgings from other skaters, that there's just no comparison.

I wasn't too sure because these boots promise to offer just as as much side stiffness, with more ankle flexibility. This could be useful in making it easier to point the toe, etc...but it also seems you could develop a lot of bad habits by not learning to bend the knees enough.

Interesting to see what happens with people if these come out.

[russiet]

The hinged cuff skate boot may not yet be ready for prime time, but it will be someday.

Cross country skate-skiing uses hinged cuff boots. Alpine ski boots are hinge-cuffed. There is no issue with the cuffs malfunctioning.

It is also possible to create a varying amount of permitted forward flex. Also stiffness can be controlled through the use of urethane inserts (hi-tech rubberry stuff that can be formulated to different hardnesses. Same stuff as inline skate wheels).

All this won't look pretty, unless you have an engineering bent. But I bet something like this will be worn in compitition within the next 10 years.

The ability to custom adjust your boot for degree of flex and stiffness is on the horizon.

[jmp123]

Here's a better article with pictures. It's my understanding that these have been undergoing testing for quite some time. I wouldn't mind trying these.

http://www.skatelog.com/skates/hinged-figure-skate.htm

[Tessie]

The hinged cuff skate boot may not yet be ready for prime time, but it will be someday.

Cross country skate-skiing uses hinged cuff boots. Alpine ski boots are hinge-cuffed. There is no issue with the cuffs malfunctioning.

It is also possible to create a varying amount of permitted forward flex. Also stiffness can be controlled through the use of urethane inserts (hi-tech rubberry stuff that can be formulated to different hardnesses. Same stuff as inline skate wheels).

All this won't look pretty, unless you have an engineering bent. But I bet something like this will be worn in compitition within the next 10 years.

The ability to custom adjust your boot for degree of flex and stiffness is on the horizon.

I ski in the x-country hinged boots, but you don't exactly try for jumps in those boots. Down hill ski boots although hinged are still quite stiff, if not no less toture traps than un hinged ski boots.

[Anita18]

Down hill ski boots although hinged are still quite stiff, if not no less toture traps than un hinged ski boots.
I'll never complain about wearing skates again after skiing an entire day in rental boots. MOST painful thing to happen to my feet EVER.

[LWalsh]

I think it's great we finally have an advance in skating gear. The flat-foot comment has been misunderstood. Even though our toes reach the ice first, it's not by much (which was the point not well articulated in the article). They are expecting with these boots that skaters will really have their toes pointed (think old ice show posters and dancers) and this will really lessen the impact. The best and obvious advantage IMHO for adult skaters is the increase in being able to bend our knees.

It's nice to see some research $ spent and technical advances like we see in other sports like skiing. Figure skating hasn't changed very much in 50 years but think about the ski boots people wore 50 years ago. We are a group that is quite resistant to change. I hope these are successful.

[fadedstardust]

Yeah but in those ice shows, the people weren't doing triples. You cannot have the flexibility to bend your knees more and point your toes more and everything and still have enough support to land triples and quads. I know there are injuries, but injuries come from bad technique, freak accidents, and pounding away at high revolution jumps all day, everyday, for years. I really don't think you can limit them, it's already a wonder there aren't MORE injuries than there are right now, I mean everyone is shocked at the high injury rate, but look at what we are making our bodies do! That's like when they introduced Gaynor Minden pointe shoes to try and "help" dancers. Yeah, well everyone bought them, hated them, and they became a laughing stock. They didn't make you work through your foot like regular pointe shoes did, and every one lost a lot of muscle and ability by wearing them for too long, and they couldn't do what they did in regular pointe shoes. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, and yeah there are injuries, but in that case- reduce the number of triples allowed per program, or take them out altogether and re-introduced figures. But that boot isn't going to change anything, as much as I'm sure people have good intentions in creating them. I honestly think that book WILL produce more injuries. There's just not enough shock absorption in hinged boots when you're trying to land triple jumps.