extreme flexibility

[passion]

I'm just wondering how someone can become *extremely* flexible. I'm talking about whipping your leg behind you and grabbing it with both hands (Bielmann), doing a sit spin and pulling your leg in front of you or the side of you at a 180 degrees angle, or doing a spiral/Charlotte spiral with the leg at 180 degress. I would love to be able to do these things. How do you practice these stretches off the ice?

[Sk8r4Life]

I think part of it is inherited--you have to be born with the ability or propensity to become very flexible. After that, I think you have to begin working on it at a fairly young age and really dedicate yourself to working on your stretches daily for at least 20 min. or so. The Cirque du Soleil performers, who are probably among the most flexible people in the world, begin training practically from birth and train constantly. It probably helps a lot to have someone who is helping you stretch--getting into the position and helping you hold it. I believe Sasha Cohen has said her mom helped her a lot to become so flexible.

Being able to hold positions like the Charlotte is not just flexibility either. It requires a lot of strength in the back and hip flexors to be able to hold that leg up.

Last year in Skating magazine they published a two-part article on how to improve your spirals. The strengthening exercises were lying on your stomach and lifting legs and arms up and out, and lying on your back with knees bent, straightening and lifting one leg at a time. Flexibility exercises were lunge stretches, standing V stretch, hamstring stretches, splits, spiral position, standing with leg lifted forward to wall. They do help but you really have to work at it, especially if you are an adult!

[fadedstardust]

Some of it you're born with I guess, but when I started ballet, I was older than most- I was 14...and I had almost NO flexibility. I actually quit ballet when I was little because I couldn't do a split and it frustrated me, hahaha. But after a year or so in daily ballet class I was able to do the splits, and now I'd say my flexiblity is my greatest asset in skating. I can get my leg at 180 (okay, maybe 178 ;P) degrees and things like that...I stretch every single day, twice a day...if I don't I'm screwed, even people like Sasha stress the importance of daily stretching at the peril of your extension...I spend 30 mins on the first stretch session, 15 on the second...sometimes I slack a little on the second. The way to make progress is that you have to be able to push yourself a bit past the "pain" limit whilst still knowing when to stop so you don't pull anything.

I think that if your bones are still loose, you could achieve the extension you want...I'd say after maybe 16 or 17 years old there isn't as much hope for a total 180 because your bones have finished their ossification (sp?) but there are exceptions to EVERY rule. What I would do if I were you is enroll in a ballet class that'll teach you to stretch properly, and then stretch RELIGIOUSLY. It's like everything else...results come in time...and it may be months before you really see much improvements but you WILL, whether you're 10 or 90 years old. Promise. And it's so great for your muscles...makes everything leaner. Stretching is the best thing in the world. :D

-FadedStardust

[MQSeries]

If you haven't been practicing your flexibility since you were a tiny weeny intsy todler then you can pretty much forget about achieving "extreme flexibility" once you get into your mid-teen and beyond. However, I do think anyone can develop enough flexibility to achieve a decent camel position, i.e the free leg is at least in line with the head, even if she didn't start stretching until the adult-stage. My biggest pet peeve is seeing an elite eligible skater, especially the men, doing a camel spin with the free leg lower than the head. There's no reason for that if she/he just pust some effort into daily stretching to get that leg up.

[SkateGuard]

I have excellent flexibility, and I never started seriously stretching until high school...when I was on the cross country team. However, my flexibility didn't improve until I started skating...at 22! I injured my hip learning my salchow, and my physical therapist gave me some wonderful stretches to make my hips more flexible and better able to handle the swinging of the free leg in the jump. The plus side...I finally got both of my splits, something I never had when I tried ballet (2 years) or gymnastics (6 mo.)

I know a physically fit 55 y.o. woman who had no flexibility until she started doing yoga as a way to stay active without hurting her joints. (Arthritis at an early age is common in her family.) Now she can do the splits!

Erin

[Sk8Bunny]

If you haven't been practicing your flexibility since you were a tiny weeny intsy todler then you can pretty much forget about achieving "extreme flexibility" once you get into your mid-teen and beyond.

I have to disagree. Ok, so I was born hyper-mobile, which means my muscles have the capacity(??not the word i was looking for??) to be very stretchable. BUT - I never stretched when I was young. In fact, I didnt start doing stretches until I was 12 or 13 years old, when I started taking skating seriously. My spirals used to be hardly above my hips, and I couldnt do a layback, decent ina bauer or anything. I began stretching nightly in my early teens and now I am 16 and have flexibility similar to Sasha Cohen's. No lie. I can do beilmanns, laybacks, and charlottes of 180 degrees. I still have to stretch everyday for about 20 minutes to keep this flexibitily -but it can be done - no matter what age you start stretching! True, some people just arent born to be very flexible. But if you stretch, it will help no matter what. Just to add - having strong muscles (thigh, calf, etc) really helps flexibilty as well because you can hold a position longer if your you have strong muscles.

[IceAngel2007]

umm, i am a training-contortionist:)hehe. seriously! i was in a skating show, and at the end of it, me and my former pairs partner did a split on the ice:) u know that y spin sasha does? well I can do that, i can put both of my legs behind my head, etc. etc. etc. lol i did ballet from age 3-7, gymnastics from age 6-still doing it on my own, and skating from age 7-still doing it. so yah that all helped!

[LittleBitSk8er]

One way: Take a nice hot bath then stretch your muscles for 20-30 minutes. This is great for any age person.:mrgreen:

Now if only I could commit to that nightly! The stretch not the bath.

[TashaKat]

The way to make progress is that you have to be able to push yourself a bit past the "pain" limit whilst still knowing when to stop so you don't pull anything.

I'm sorry but I totally disagree, you should NEVER push yourself TO the pain limit never mind past it! If you're experiencing pain then you're tearing your muscles which is, obviously, not a good thing. Contrary to popular opinion you can injure yourself stretching! Another thing to remember is to hold the stretch, don't bounce, if you think of an elastic band ..... stretch it and let it go straight away and it will ping back to it's original length, stretch it and hold it for some time and there will be a slight lengthening.

I'm another 'lucky' (although my osteopath didn't seem to think so) hyper mobile personage so can still do the splits, put my hands on the floor etc even if I haven't stretched for months (apparently I *could* have become a contortionist :idea: ) but 'extreme' stretching is going to be more difficult to achieve, if impossible, for someone in their 20's+ who has never stretched before BUT there is nothing to stop you from working towards your limits safely, and, I would advise, under supervision :D

Good luck


L x

[IceAngel2007]

do you think it is normal to be able to do all three splits right after another consecutively? without getting up, just switching into them? Cause I was finally able to do that last night:)

[quarkiki2]

do you think it is normal to be able to do all three splits right after another consecutively? without getting up, just switching into them? Cause I was finally able to do that last night:)

Well, I think it's normal, but I have always been able to do the splits any-which-way. Consecutively and without getting up. And without warming up. And I'm 30 and fat, LOL! In ballet class, I would leave shoe prints on my forehead when I did stag leaps.

Clearly genetics play a part in this for me, because I am the first to admit that I only stretch before I get on the ice -- so two or three times a week. And I don't stretch to gain flexibility, but to warm up and avoid injury.

If I were to become suddenly interested in hyper-flexibility (not likely as I'd rather learn to skate better, LOL!) I'd do ballet barre work, yoga and pilates.

The biggest problem with natural flexibility is that it's really hard to strengthen your joints when your tendons are a little too long. It is physically impossible to tighten loose tendons without surgery, so I sometimes have difficulty with unstable joints, particularly when I have been stretching a lot -- especially my ankles. The good news is, even if I twist an ankle, if everything is loose it doesn't really hurt that much!

[IceAngel2007]

also what scares me is im the only athletic person in my family.

[passion]

Everybody's input is so interesting. This is for the people who have posted here and are extremely flexible: :bow:

I know that when you overly stretch (perhaps when it becomes painful) the muscle actually contracts to protect itself from injury, so it actually becomes counterproductive to overstretch. I also learnt from my physio that hyperflexibility is actually not a good thing because the ligaments that hold the joint loosen, so the joint is less stable which makes it susceptible to injury.

Yesterday I spent 30 mins stretching. At first I was really sore and stiff, but eventually I was able to improve that one particular stretch quite a bit. Yay! :) When I was a kid I would do a back bend and thread my arms, head and chest through my legs. That was twenty years ago!

Once, I went to a rhthmic gymnastics club and watched the competitve rhthmic gymnasts stretch. Like, OMG! They were practicing the oversplits. They put one leg on a chair with the other one on the ground to do the vertical splits. They made a V position! 8O To do the horizontal splits, they put both feet on two chairs on either side of them.

I only took a handful of beginner ballet classes and we did no stretching whatsover.

So for those of you who can spin with the leg 180 degrees in front of you, how do you grab and hold the leg? I mean, are you just holding on to the leg with both hands, or does one hand hold the blade and the other the leg? As for the spin thats 180 degress to the side, do you grab the leg from outside the ankle, or from inside the ankle?

[fadedstardust]

I'm sorry but I totally disagree, you should NEVER push yourself TO the pain limit never mind past it! If you're experiencing pain then you're tearing your muscles which is, obviously, not a good thing. Contrary to popular opinion you can injure yourself stretching! Another thing to remember is to hold the stretch, don't bounce, if you think of an elastic band ..... stretch it and let it go straight away and it will ping back to it's original length, stretch it and hold it for some time and there will be a slight lengthening.


You can very much injure yourself through stretching, this is why I suggested a class to get them started. But...when you are stretching (I also agree with not bouncing, I forgot that part...VERY important) when you get to where you should stop, it SHOULDN'T be comfortable, otherwise you'll never get more stretch, just maintain what you've got. It shouldn't hurt, it should however, have a little discomfort. That's what I believe and have gone by since I was little, I've never hurt myself. Of course, I could just be communicating wrong.

-FadedStardust

[fadedstardust]

Everybody's input is so interesting. This is for the people who have posted here and are extremely flexible: :bow:

I know that when you overly stretch (perhaps when it becomes painful) the muscle actually contracts to protect itself from injury, so it actually becomes counterproductive to overstretch. I also learnt from my physio that hyperflexibility is actually not a good thing because the ligaments that hold the joint loosen, so the joint is less stable which makes it susceptible to injury.

Yesterday I spent 30 mins stretching. At first I was really sore and stiff, but eventually I was able to improve that one particular stretch quite a bit. Yay! :) When I was a kid I would do a back bend and thread my arms, head and chest through my legs. That was twenty years ago!

Once, I went to a rhthmic gymnastics club and watched the competitve rhthmic gymnasts stretch. Like, OMG! They were practicing the oversplits. They put one leg on a chair with the other one on the ground to do the vertical splits. They made a V position! 8O To do the horizontal splits, they put both feet on two chairs on either side of them.

I only took a handful of beginner ballet classes and we did no stretching whatsover.

So for those of you who can spin with the leg 180 degrees in front of you, how do you grab and hold the leg? I mean, are you just holding on to the leg with both hands, or does one hand hold the blade and the other the leg? As for the spin thats 180 degress to the side, do you grab the leg from outside the ankle, or from inside the ankle?

I've never tried it to the side, I can glide as a spiral to the side with it close to 180, for that I bend my leg over my knee and lean over slightly after which I grab the underneath of the toe pic (the arched part) with a couple fingers and just bring the leg up that way.

For the front spin, I hold the blade a similar way, with both hands. It's...far from my best spin, haha, I have the stretch but not necessarily the balance needed for it, hahaha, but I have done it, and that was how. Of course, with the biellman (leg bent to the back and over your head) you also grab the arch of the toe pick with your fingers to get there, start with a catch foot with your side parallel to the ice and bring it up.

I suck at explanations. :(

-FadedStardust

[fadedstardust]

do you think it is normal to be able to do all three splits right after another consecutively? without getting up, just switching into them? Cause I was finally able to do that last night:)

Yes, Ideally, you want to be able to do that. It means your hips are very open, which is good for splits, obviously. Congrats!! :)

-FadedStardust

[IceAngel2007]

Passion: from the outside of the ankle
and thank you to FadedStarDust

[passion]

Thank you IceAngel and FadedstarDust for the tip.

[IceAngel2007]

you're welcome:)